[5NL] QJs on button, flop decision.

Originally Posted by spoonitnow

3-betting is fine. No reason to give him a free card when you're ahead of his continuing range.

If we 3bet, say $1.70, are we happy to get our stack in if he 4bet shoves or do we now fold?

Originally Posted by Cobra_1878

If we 3bet, say $1.70, are we happy to get our stack in if he 4bet shoves or do we now fold?

If he shoves it's just a case of using this formula again;

(Amount hero has to call)/(total pot) to be won by hero or villain after you call.

Originally Posted by Cobra_1878

If we 3bet, say $1.70, are we happy to get our stack in if he 4bet shoves or do we now fold?

This is absolutely insane.

Originally Posted by Icanhastreebet

This is absolutely insane.

You're so fucking helpful man, I love you.

Of the range you give villain when he raises the flop (I'm not sure J7-J8o would be in his range preflop, but otherwise, it sounds pretty reasonable to me), what do you think he would fold to a 3bet? Stuff like 99-TT, QJ, non-spade 65? So against his continuing range you'd be at something like this?

Board: 8s 7s Jc
Dead:

equity win tie pots won pots tied
Hand 0: 46.336% 46.01% 00.33% 32794 234.50 { QsJs }
Hand 1: 53.664% 53.33% 00.33% 38017 234.50 { JJ+, 88-77, AsKs, AJs, KJs, JTs, J8s, T9s, 98s, 87s, 6s5s, AJo, KJo, T9o, 87o }

With fold equity and the chance villain could be spazzing, this seems like it could be a profitable semi-bluff, right? (I actually kind of suck at 3betting, so I am running through this thought process for my own good too.)

Originally Posted by Malbrack

Of the range you give villain when he raises the flop (I'm not sure J7-J8o would be in his range preflop, but otherwise, it sounds pretty reasonable to me), what do you think he would fold to a 3bet? Stuff like 99-TT, QJ, non-spade 65? So against his continuing range you'd be at something like this?

Board: 8s 7s Jc
Dead:

equity win tie pots won pots tied
Hand 0: 46.336% 46.01% 00.33% 32794 234.50 { QsJs }
Hand 1: 53.664% 53.33% 00.33% 38017 234.50 { JJ+, 88-77, AsKs, AJs, KJs, JTs, J8s, T9s, 98s, 87s, 6s5s, AJo, KJo, T9o, 87o }

With fold equity and the chance villain could be spazzing, this seems like it could be a profitable semi-bluff, right? (I actually kind of suck at 3betting, so I am running through this thought process for my own good too.)

That makes a lot of sense. 3betting looks like the best option, great post.

Sorry, semi-bluff was the wrong word in my last post (for some reason I thought hero had two overcards, not top pair) since hero is probably not getting better to fold (would villain fold KJ?). But if we put 99-TT back in villain's range (which isn't too unreasonable since it would be pair+gutshot), hero has 51.7% equity to villain's continuing range.

Originally Posted by Cobra_1878

You're so fucking helpful man, I love you.

Maybe if you took 30seconds to plug your hand into pokerstove v just about any realistic range you'll see that 3b/folding is retarded and you won't have to post retarded questions no one wants to waste their time answering.

Originally Posted by Icanhastreebet

you won't have to post retarded questions no one wants to waste their time answering.

This is what the beginners circle is all about.

Originally Posted by Icanhastreebet

Maybe if you took 30seconds to plug your hand into pokerstove v just about any realistic range you'll see that 3b/folding is retarded and you won't have to post retarded questions no one wants to waste their time answering.

Pretty sure this is unnecessary, especially in the BC. No one is forcing you to even read this.

@ImSavy - please post a range, or even a hand that we are "absolutely crushed by". With TP+FD+Overcard (and even a backdoor straight draw) we are 30% against even JJ.

Originally Posted by Pelion

Pretty sure this is unnecessary, especially in the BC. No one is forcing you to even read this.

@ImSavy - please post a range, or even a hand that we are "absolutely crushed by". With TP+FD+Overcard (and even a backdoor straight draw) we are 30% against even JJ.

Bad terminology on my part, just meant beat.

Something along the lines of QQ, JJ, 88, 77, ATs+, 9T which is still only 62%.

Originally Posted by Pelion

Pretty sure this is unnecessary, especially in the BC. No one is forcing you to even read this.

@ImSavy - please post a range, or even a hand that we are "absolutely crushed by". With TP+FD+Overcard (and even a backdoor straight draw) we are 30% against even JJ.

Pretty sure he could have interpreted my previous answer as a "no" and if he wanted to know exactly why I would have told him but since he answered with a very sarcastic "man, I fucking love you" Why would I help an ungrateful twat?

Originally Posted by Icanhastreebet

Pretty sure he could have interpreted my previous answer as a "no" and if he wanted to know exactly why I would have told him but since he answered with a very sarcastic "man, I fucking love you" Why would I help an ungrateful twat?

I hope you're not sore after that whole SC's/S1G's OOP discussion we had.

Your answer was not very helpful, therefore I replied in a sarcastic manner which you obviously took to heart. It was only supposed to be light hearted, didn't mean for you to take it the wrong way.